The Parley Podcast Interview

[00:00:16.19] - TLO

What up, you all?

[00:00:17.11] - TLO

Welcome into the Parlay. A long time, 15-year MBA veteran, Mr. Kendall Gill in the building. Kg, what's

up, man?

[00:00:24.21] - Kendal Gill

Nothing much, man. Glad to be here.

[00:00:26.21] - TLO

I like the hoodie. You like this? Yes.

[00:00:29.12] - TLO

Who to fight.

[00:00:29.21] - TLO

Very nice.

[00:00:31.15] - TLO

Mike Tyson. I wear this every once in a while. I got a lot of this stuff, though. You know what I mean?

[00:00:37.15] - TLO

Yeah, of course, man. Boxing merch is always sick. You know what I'm saying? I don't have mine on

right now, but I should have put it on. Parlay is sponsored by 6040 Club. If you want to know Kendall

Gill's workout regimen, which, by the way, I've been seeing, it's back. Am I right? Are you out there or

some people out there doing 6040?

[00:00:53.06] - TLO

Well, the weather is getting better. So I'm back out. I don't like to run when it's cold now that I'm in my

50s. For sure. Before, I used to do that rocky-style type stuff. But now that I'm older, no, man, I got to

wait for the warmer weather.

[00:01:10.13] - TLO

Yeah, man. No, for sure. But love to see you at 6040. If you want to know Kendall's workout regimen,

and how to get in shape in a crazy amount of regimens. What is it? What do we call these?

Calisthenics. Calisthenics. There you go. You got to check it out. It's definitely a dope thing to see.

That I've never done. Still, after-We got to get you out.

[00:01:33.19] - TLO

8 years. Yeah, for real.

[00:01:36.01] - TLO

60/40 Club, sponsored by 60/40. We do have a special guest in studio. We haven't been on for a

while, so we're going to be back giving you guys those weekly shows that we promised. And the

boxing season is heating up. We got a huge event coming up next week in New York. I can't wait to

see how that plays out outside in Manhattan with superstars all over the place. So I can't wait to see

that. We'll talk about that later on in the show. But we do have a special guest in studio locally here

from Chicago. I like to bring in people from our city because Chicago is slept on in the boxing

community after speaking to people nationally. I mean, they look at Chicago and they say, Yeah, all

right. I'm like, What? We have such a-When Chicago used to be the Mecca. Yeah.

[00:02:21.18] - TLO

I mean, next to New York, back when they used to bring in Sugar Ray Robinson and all those guys, and

used to fight here at Chicago Chicago Stadium. Muhammad Ali used to live here, of course. We've had

some champions to come through here.[00:02:35.15] - TLO

Allstate Arena, too. Allstate Arena, yeah. David Dia, shout out. But Chicago is definitely immersed in

boxing, many boxing communities, many gyms, and many important people in the boxing community.

The gentleman I want to bring up, his name is Jason Prinzo, right? Yes. Prinzo, I want to say that right.

He is a music executive and a mental health keynote speaker and works with a A promotional

company out here mentoring boxers and speaking to them. Jason, it's a pleasure to have you, man.

[00:03:05.18] - Jason

Man, I really appreciate you guys having me on, especially for a subject that can be difficult to talk

about, but an important one.

[00:03:11.28] - TLO

We have Jason here at KG because we want to talk about something that's really not talked about, I

think, too much in this sport, specifically. We talked about this topic, I think, in many other sports.

There's been documentaries, but really, in a combat sport like boxing, we think mental health has got

to be one the most important things now, especially boxing being known as one of the most loneliest

sports ever, right? Or maybe even combat sports, if you want to say, if you want to put them in that

category. But Jason, you're here to talk about a little mental health in boxing and how that affects

boxers. And so I'll leave it to you. What really inspired you to start, I guess, putting a focus on mental

health with boxers?

[00:03:55.04] - Jason

So my mental health journey started at a really young age. I was diagnosed with major depressive at

five. This is something I've been dealing with my whole life, and it's become really important to me.

But my first love, my first sport love, was boxing. I come from Cincinnati. I grew up watching Aaron

prior. Aaron and I became really close when he got older, and Aaron struggled a lot with addiction and

things like that. So the mental health and boxing, especially in the last six, seven years since guys

have been coming out and talking about it, whether it's Tyson Fury, Ricky Hatton has We talked a lot

about it. Obviously, Danny Garcia has probably been up front more than anybody. And even Ryan

Garcia, which we all know how that all went down, especially during the Haynie build up. We've got

guys that are struggling. Mike Tyson struggled. We can get into what happened with Oliver McCall in

the Lennox-Lewis fight. I mean, that, to me, looked like a panic attack. I have a hard time believing that

wasn't a panic attack. You When you break down like that in the ring, panic attacks are overwhelming.

[00:05:03.18] - Jason

If you've never had one, it feels like a heart attack, and it feels like the walls are crashing down on you.

Like you said, it's a lonely sport, man. You did both. You played team sports and you fought. You could

have an off night team sports, and people are going to pick you up. You can't have an off night when

you're fighting. It's lonely, and everything is on you. That's a lot of pressure.

[00:05:28.23] - TLO

It is. You go back to you spoke about or mentioned Ricky Haddon. I remember Ricky Haddon was

knocked out by Manny Pacquiao. He said he went into a major depression because of that. I think

that us as athletes, especially when you get to the top like Manny Pacquiao, Floyd Mayweather, or

Ricky Haddon, once you're knocked off of that pedestal, then now it's like the mask has been pulled

off, your cape has been taken away. Because up until that point, Ricky Haddon only had lost to Floyd

Mayweather. Right. And now he thinks his sense of invincible now is gone. And that's tough to deal

with, Mitchell.

[00:06:12.01] - Jason

It's funny you mentioned that there's a series of books by a guy. I want to say his name is Dan

Sheridan, but he did a bunch of combat sports books where he went around the world and trained at

different like, gyms. There's one book called like a fighter's heart. There's a fighter's mind. And in a

fighter's mind, he talked about that you see combat sports fighters that after the fight, we know they

clearly lost. I think Bernard Hopkins is a great example of this, but that is sitting there going, There's

no way. I got cheated. I did not lose this fight. And it's because you have to mentally think that you are

unbeatable to go into that ring. And the only way that you can lose is if you got cheated. And to yourpoint, when that barrier gets broken down, that's tough to deal with, man. That sense of self and your

identity goes away, and that's tough for those guys.

[00:07:03.25] - Kendal Gill

It does. I'm going to use a basketball perspective. I played for 15 years in the league when I used to

see When I used to see guys come in and get cut from a team, you could see right away that they

were the man in high school. They were the man in college. Now, when they get to the pros, they can

still play, and they're still good enough. But some team says, You're not good enough to play for this

team, which is a tremendous mental hit. I saw it time after time. I was lucky enough, blessed enough

to be where I wasn't one of those guys. But I could see each and every year, I knew it was coming.

When you'd have a guy in training camp, you knew he was good enough, but you knew what was

coming. And mentally, he was going to have to take... It was going to be tough for him in the next

couple of weeks or so to get over what was going to eventually happen being released from the team.

[00:08:05.21] - Jason

Yeah. I think that happens in all major sports when it comes to retirement, right? Because normally,

it's not your decision. And something you've been doing since you were five or six years old is

suddenly taken away from you. If you're a guy that didn't make a retirement money, now you're in your

30s, man, trying to figure out your career. You may not have the formal education, you don't have work

experience, and now you're trying to figure it out. I know that's something that professional athletes in

general all go through. I think Dwyane Wade talked about that he was going to go to therapy during

his retirement just for that transition. You got fighters that have been doing this their whole lives, and

you're taking Ls, and it's over. That's a tough pill to swallow, man. And those guys really struggle with

that.

[00:08:51.23] - Kendal Gill

Jason, would you think a perfect example of this would probably be at the current time, Deontay

Wilder?

[00:09:00.05] - Jason

Yes.

[00:09:01.10] - TLO

Is that why you think he's trying to come back now?

[00:09:03.16] - Jason

I mean, look, again, you understand this. Deontay is what? 38, 39, 40? That's still young. That's still

really young. And his body probably feels the exact same as it did at 28. And you think you can go out

there and do it, and you don't know anything else. What is Deontay Wilder going to do from here on?

He was on a reality show a couple of years ago, and he left. It was one of those ones where you live in

this house and stuff like that. He left after four or five days. I feel bad for guys like that because if you

don't have some outlet or you don't have something to transition to, your life loses a sense of

purpose. You've got to have something driving you in order to keep yourself healthy. Boxers get a bad

reputation, especially after they retire, because there are so many examples of guys that have fallen

off after retirement. We always I don't want to say that it's because of their background or where they

came from. But nearly every sport, guys are coming from the same place. It's not just a boxer's thing. I

think it goes back to it being a really lonely sport.

[00:10:11.27] - Jason

I think there's much more CTE trauma than what we know. And while things like addiction isn't a part

of CTE, CTE changes your ability to make decisions, which then leads into drug abuse. You're

spending money much you were before, and then it just leads them into a bad place. I think so many

of these guys really struggle with that after retirement. We talked about this a little earlier, all the

sparring. It's not the big shots, the knockout shots you take. It's the jabs. It's the little shots over and

over and over. And headgear or not, these guys are taking damage. If you're already having some

mental health issues, it's crushing.[00:10:57.04] - TLO

Do you have a personal experience Did you box before? Or was it something that you saw from a

family member or a friend that really-As far as mental health and boxing?

[00:11:09.22] - Jason

Yeah. I box as an amateur for a while, and it's tough. I'm very open about my struggles. Imposter

syndrome is a really big thing that I struggle with. Being a guy that didn't pick up the sport as far as

being an active until I was in my 30s, I always felt way behind. I This is going to sound strange, but

where I am in life today is much different than where I came from. I realized that walking into a gym,

I'm going to look like the typical white collar businessman fighter. For me, I never wanted to be looked

at like that. I felt like I needed to go overboard and really impress people with going in and sparring

with guys that were killers. I just wanted to prove myself. I never felt like I got there. I always felt I

wasn't good enough. You get out of sparring. My trainer at the time, Lalo Bayes, I would get out of

sparring, and I was like, Man, he hit me a few times here. Because I felt like every time I got punched, I

was messing up. Lalo would say, Hey, man, you take a shower, you're going to get wet.

[00:12:16.11] - Jason

You're going to box, you're going to get hit. It doesn't mean that you're not doing a good job. I don't

remember any punch I've ever landed. I remember nearly every punch I got hit with.

[00:12:24.07] - Kendal Gill

I used to see Jason spar a lot, so I know he did pretty good.

[00:12:28.24] - Jason

You know what? I I won my division of the Golden Gloves in 2014, so I'll take that and walk away. But

because both things are near and dear to me, and so many guys started speaking out, it became an

important topic for me. I grew up a huge Mike Tyson fan, and it clearly Mike has struggled with mental

health issues. One of the things I don't think people realize is a lot of these moments where Mike has

acted out, and I think the Lennox-Lewis moment is a perfect example. When you're taking medication

for mental health, it definitely calms you down. Without knowing what Mike was taking, Mike was

probably taking something that leveled him off. When you stop taking certain medications, you have

to wean off of it because if you just stop taking it, it ramps up everything, and it makes you way more

irritable, way more aggressive, and way more angry. I can see a situation. They did take Mike off

medication whenever he'd start training camp because you got to have him be a killer. But it would

send him into this place that made him super angry. So when you see him acting out like the Van der

Huy field fight or the Lennox-Lewish press conference- Or even that one's after.

[00:13:40.17] - TLO

Yeah. He has it all adding up every fight after. Yeah.

[00:13:43.11] - Kendal Gill

I mean, that moment where He's yelling at guys from the table in the Lenny's Louis press conference,

again, also looks like a panic attack. Like, he's crying as he's yelling at these guys. That's a

breakdown, man. And it was probably because he was pulled off his medication in order to train. And

It's difficult because it's... Look, as men, and this is becoming a bigger topic, as men, we're taught at a

young age not to deal with our emotions. We're taught to toughen up. Big boys don't cry. We're never

taught how to problem-solve. We're never taught how to de-escalate anything. We're just taught that

power, strength, all of that means better. Don't cry. You got to shove it down. It It's an unfortunate

thing that gets drilled into us because we grow up and become adults thinking the same thing, and we

hold everything in because we think talking about it makes us weak.

[00:14:40.04] - TLO

Yeah, that's 100% correct. I I just recently had a friend pass away last week. I'm sorry to hear that.

Yeah, last week today. But normally, I'm not emotional about anything like that. I'm telling you, man,

the next Monday, we got together a bunch guys that played ball together and everything. I just couldn't

hold them. So instead of me holding everything in, I just let everything out. It felt a lot better.[00:15:12.07] - Kendal Gill

I was going to say, the way that I always Related is when you're feeling sick, you don't want to get sick,

but you know if you do, you're going to feel better right away. Crying is like that sometimes. That's

what I mean, throwing up. But you know if you do it, you're going to feel better. You just got to let it

out. I've gotten to the point where I'm not even embarrassed to talk about it, man. If I'm feeling I, I'll go

somewhere and cry. I got to get it out, man. Self care is so important for all of us. We all have so

much pressure career-wise, relationship-wise. As men, we think we've got to control everything. Not

that we're controlling, but we think it's our job to make sure that everybody's good, that the house is

taken care of, that bills are paid, and everybody's in a good place, and then we can take care of

ourselves. But that's backwards. We can't do all those things unless we take care of ourselves. It's

funny. I had a video the other day joking around because there's this long-run joke about how when

men get sick, we become these huge babies.

[00:16:16.20] - Kendal Gill

Babies. It is absolutely true. But it's the one time we're allowed to be weak. It's the one time we're

allowed to sit there and let somebody else take care of us. So we're going to lean all the way into it,

man. You all heard? Man, for real? Cut us a break.

[00:16:35.10] - TLO

I was looking at the camera, but you know what? Behind the camera is Nikki. Shots of her.

[00:16:39.27] - Kendal Gill

I'm looking at her, too. So, man, you add all that stuff in with a sport that forces you to be aggressive,

and you have to lean into that, man. It's a dangerous combination.

[00:16:53.15] - TLO

Jason, when you think of guys retiring and they don't know what else to do in their mental health

suffers, what about the guys that do know what they want to do and continue to be in a spotlight after

they retire, a. K. Freud, Money, Mayweather? How is that mental makeup? I mean, is he happy? Is he

trying to fulfill something?

[00:17:19.27] - Kendal Gill

Man, that's a great question because I don't know what motivates a lot of guys. So I think it's

important of what motivates guys. I think if you look at somebody from an MMA standpoint, like a

Conor McGregor, that thrives off of attention, that attention has to get bolder and bolder and bolder,

right? Because after a while, it's like, oh, yeah, Conor has been doing that his whole life, right? So it's

got to be more crazy and more crazy. Guys like that, and you've probably known some, but you guys

probably both known some people that they have a public persona. What people don't realize is,

celebrities are not who they are in front of the camera. That's a show. But a lot of guys become their

gimmick. I think Stephen A. Smith right now has turned into his television gimm. And so you see guys

like Conor that have turned into that. That's just become their personality. It Like, crazy or outlandish

has become their thing. So they lean into it.

[00:18:19.01] - TLO

And it's just-Shannon Sharpe, for example. Yeah. And he has really leaned into it.

[00:18:27.12] - Kendal Gill

Right. Look, I think it's important. That everybody has some outlets and hobbies. I always say that it's

going to sound corny, but I have a happy list. I have a list of things that make me happy. I love going

to a coffee shop. That's self-care for me. I love going to the boxing gym. The boxing gym is one of the

best things workout-wise that you can do for your mental health. It gets out of aggression. It releases

endorphins. There's been studies that show how great boxing is for mental health. But I've got this list

of things that make me happy. Listen to music. I try to do one every single day, even if it's just 15

minutes. I have to have that in order to reset my mental health, reset my brain, because otherwise, I've

got a thousand voices in my head all telling me different stuff, and I need it to stop. I need that to stop

for a minute because that's constant pressure. That's good.[00:19:20.18] - TLO

Can you give us three things that boxers should do to protect their mental health? I'm sure there's It's

a ton of things, but top three things for you, you think they should really consider to protect

themselves?

[00:19:36.16] - Kendal Gill

I think if you're unwilling to go and find therapy, and the reason I say that even if you're not struggling

with your mental health, I always say we diet in order to avoid heart disease and diabetes, but nobody

does anything about their mental health until there's a problem. I think it's important for everybody to

start finding those outlets early on. I'm a big proponent of therapy, but if you're not willing to do that,

just small things like journaling, just writing stuff down and getting it out, not only allows you to have a

release, but you start thinking of stuff differently. I'll be honest, I do this when my wife and I are

fighting, where I'm mad, and she's in the other room, and I'm like, I'm just going to write this note to

her and leave it here. She's going to see what I really think. After I write it, it's so cathartic, and then I

read it, and it sounds ridiculous. It's helpful for me. Journaling is a A really important one. I think one

of the most important things any of us can do is socialize. Spending time with your friends is one of

the biggest deterrents of issues with your mental health.

[00:20:45.02] - Kendal Gill

There's a sense of community, there's a sense of belonging, there's shared experience. In a sport that

is so isolating, spending time around others, whether it's other guys in the gym, whether it's your

friendship circle, making sure that you get out is vitally important. It's one of the best things you can

do for your mental health is socializing. I think that continuing to find the things that you love. Any

creative outlet is great. I started painting about five or six years ago, and it's probably been one of the

best things I've ever done from my anxiety. Nice. Because when you're working on that, that's why

adult coloring books and stuff are so popular, because when you're working on that, man, you can't

think of anything else. But what you're doing in that moment is When I get to that place, I got to set an

alarm because I'll sit there for five or six hours and eat, drink, go to the bathroom. I'm just so locked

in. It just feels good because my mind's blank. I'm not thinking about all the pressures of life or things

that I got to do tomorrow or what's my schedule like.

[00:21:48.29] - Kendal Gill

I'm just thinking about that. I think creative outlets, I think journaling, if you're not willing to go to

therapy, and socializing are three of the most important things you can do.

[00:21:59.10] - TLO

My My son, who turned out to be a great basketball player in high school. But at the beginning, when

he had all these expectations on him and everything, he struggled. He was there, he was His dad is an

NBA player, and you got to live up to what your dad was and all this and that, and he struggled with

that. So eventually, he overcame it, and he was able to deal with it and everything. But I can still see it

sometimes. But now he's starting to branch off, get out of my shadow, and now he's his own man. But

the mental aspect of it was tough for a long time. My wife and I, we had to deal with it, and he

struggled. I advise him to do the same thing, which is let's go box. Let's do something other than

basketball. And it helped out a great deal. My thing is, it's boxing, but also cutting the grass and

pulling weeds, making sure my garden is straight.

[00:23:03.23] - TLO

That's a little hit of dopamine, too, right?

[00:23:04.25] - TLO

When you see-No, for real, though. For real. When I cut the grass the right way, when I used to do it

when I was a kid, how my dad showed me and everything, when I'm going to get weeds out of garden,

that's why I don't let anybody cut my grass. Why are you cutting grass? A higher landscape. I was like,

Yeah, but this is my thing. This is the way that I can... Same way you were painting. I can quiet my

mind. I'm out here. Life isn't bothering me. It's just I'm at peace. That's why I do it.

[00:23:34.04] - Kendal GillIt's funny. You talk about the dopamine release, and I think that's an important thing to talk about

because for most professional athletes, like football, you've got that game on Sunday. You have this

release. And Every time you have a major dopamine release, there's a crash afterwards. Boxers only

get that once every six months. Then you crash and you got nothing else to lift you back up until you

have another fight. It's like a hard week. Yeah, exactly. It's like starting over all the time. That can be

really tough. At NBA, you guys have several games a week, so you're constantly moving on where as a

fighter, you got that release, then there's a crash. But you've got people that are depending on you,

your trainer, your manager. All these people are depending on you, and that's a lot of pressure,

especially when you're a young kid, 18, 19 years old. You don't even understand. And for a lot of these

guys, they're making money for the first time. And that's a lot to try to manage when you've had no

example of how to handle it or have never been taught that it's okay to feel the things that you're

feeling.

[00:24:34.28] - TLO

Right. And even though I'm not a fan of this guy, that's a big reason why Ryan Garcia is going through,

in my opinion, the things that mentally he's going through because of all the things that you just

mentioned. Right. I think he's working his way out of it with maturity, but that's a perfect example.

[00:24:54.27] - Kendal Gill

Well, you look at Ryan, you look at Danny Garcia, and it's a great example of how Fame, money,

accolades can't overcome mental illness. I think so many of us look at it like, Man, if I had that life or if

I didn't have to worry about money, I'd be great. It is just going to be something else. I was shocked. In

2018, even though I've been struggling since I was five, 2018 is when I made my real public

admission. Not that I didn't have a press conference or anything, but I posted something on

Facebook. I was surprised at the responses I got. What I was really surprised about were How many

of my former professional athlete friends that were football players that you're talking about these

alpha males or guys from the gym would come to me one on one and go, Hey, man, I didn't know you

were struggling. I feel this same thing. I've never talked to anybody about it because there's no space

to. I think that we, as men, need to realize we're all feeling the same thing, and it's okay to talk about.

It's okay to go to your best friend or somebody and admit that you're struggling because you're

probably going to find out that they have dealt with or feel those same things, and we can't keep it all

in.

[00:26:04.11] - Kendal Gill

We've got to find some release. I talk to the Chicago Police Department maybe once a week, once

every two weeks, and they're in that same boat. You all got They see stuff and deal with things that

we're never going to understand. If they don't have somebody to talk to about it, especially somebody

that's got shared experience and can understand, it's tough, man. As a boxing community, I think it's

really important that we find ways to come together and help each other and be able to talk about

these things openly without the pressure of feeling like we're going to be looked at as weak. Yeah,

judgment, all that.

[00:26:39.24] - TLO

In that same realm, as we transition a little bit here and mental health being so important in the

boxing community, any community, really. But boxing, I think it holds a little more weight because of

what they go through. How do you think Devon Haynie reacts in his next fight after what he just went

through? I am sure he went through months of some therapy or something. From getting hit by that

left hook, your first loss, to finding out that these were in the picture. Allegedly, well, actually, no, he

was banned, suspended. But how does Devon handle him?

[00:27:17.28] - Kendal Gill

Man, that's a great question. I think the wild card there, and I don't know anything about this, so I'm

not making any claims, but he's also got the pressure of his father that is very vocal. Now, he's way

more vocal than Devin is. Almost like how Danny Garcia is, where Danny's dad was the one running.

Now, you got to defend all the stuff that your dad's been saying. I don't know deep down what Devin's

feeling, but that's got to be a lot of pressure, too, where your dad's out there talking all this mess that

you got to go back up. Now you might be questioning yourself as far as what am I really capable of? Ithink Devon needs to take an easy fight this next time and get his confidence back. But he needs to

fight somebody that's going to crack him a little bit so that he knows he can still take it. Oh, he has his

opponent.

[00:28:08.23] - TLO

Right. He has his opponent. I think he's going to challenge him for sure.

[00:28:12.01] - Kendal Gill

I'll be honest with you, outside of the knockdowns, I thought Devon fought pretty well in that fight.

[00:28:16.14] - TLO

I thought he was winning.

[00:28:17.16] - TLO

rounds.

I rewatched it this week, actually, and I was like, Man, Devon was winning. He had won five or six

[00:28:22.15] - TLO

I thought he was winning until he got caught a couple of times.

[00:28:25.03] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, and I think Devon will win that rematch, right? Because boxers beat punchers nearly every time.

There's never been a big puncher that at some point in their career, went up against a guy that can

move around that didn't get beat. I've been saying for years, that's going to be Tank's downfall

because Tank gives away rounds in every fight waiting for the knockout. When he does it, he low-key

lost it last time.

[00:28:50.12] - TLO

We're not going to talk about that, though.

[00:28:52.12] - TLO

We're not going to talk about that.

[00:28:54.03] - Kendal Gill

Same thing in the Pitbull fight, right? He stayed tough the whole time, almost lost that fight. It's not a

knock on Javante because I think he could be a better boxer-puncher and get guys out of there and

box guys. But I think for Devon, he's got to get back to doing what he does best and almost just like

Stop even talking about Ryan, man. It's just bringing it back up. And you're just going to stay in that

mental space. That shit's behind him. He got to move on.

[00:29:25.11] - TLO

So you're right. I just recently saw a press conference, not a press conference, but I guess a podcast.

A sit down? A sit down with Ryan. Who else was on that?

[00:29:35.08] - TLO

Everybody. Telfimo, Ryan.

[00:29:36.28] - TLO

Telfimo, Lopes, all those guys. I wouldn't sit there with Ryan. Knowing you cheated, knowing you didn't

make way. It was an awkward.

[00:29:41.11] - TLO

Knowing you didn't make weight. It was an awkward probably.

[00:29:43.24] - TLO

Knowing you didn't make weight, you came in and you didn't come in as the contract specified. And I

found out you've been taking something and you beat me. I know it's not legally on his record, but still,he lost.

[00:30:00.08] - Kendal Gill

I think if you're Devon, and if you're Devon's father, you got to drill into his head that the only way you

were able to get beat is because this guy cheated, came in heavy, PEDs. It's the only way he could

beat you. I think that's going to be the really important next step for him. Because I've seen guys in his

position that completely just fell apart after they've taken that loss. I'm hoping for Devon because I'm

a fan. I love watching him fight.

[00:30:22.20] - TLO

Devon works the sweet science beautifully. I cannot stop. I don't think he's the best. He doesn't do it

like Floyd. He has a lot of gaps and holes in his defense and so forth, but he does work the sweet

wine as well. I'm really interested to see how he mentally adapts. But you can say something, Keja?

[00:30:43.16] - TLO

But he's not going to get over It until he does what Codo did, face Margarito. He got a face-flying.

[00:30:49.10] - TLO

Yeah.

That's another example. When Codo lost a Margarito, he went to a deep depression. We all know that.

[00:30:54.15] - TLO

And believe me, I guarantee you, Devon was depressed, too. Might still be. But he got to face that guy

on an even playing field, for him to get over this. Because I guarantee you, if he doesn't fight him

again, he'll never get over this.

[00:31:08.22] - TLO

Tito, too, KG. Tito was down bad.

[00:31:12.21] - TLO

Yeah, with Bernard Hopkins. Yeah, he was down bad after that. I was, too.

[00:31:16.05] - Kendal Gill

I love Bernard. I love this.

[00:31:18.20] - TLO

Bernard was a great fighter. But Tito was our guy. Tito was our guy. Because if Tito wins that fight,

now he goes and fights Roy Jones, which he probably would have lost, but still. And eventually, I

actually did lose to Roy, but we were on a Tito train back then.

[00:31:34.00] - Kendal Gill

See, I was a fan like Bernard and Sean Porter, those guys that maybe physically weren't as gifted than

everybody else, but figured out how to be great. I love guys like that.

[00:31:44.02] - TLO

Errol Spence is another example, too. We don't even have to talk about his mental health, which I'm

sure was hugely effective, but everything he went through before, how do you physically get back into

a ring after being destroyed?

[00:31:59.03] - Kendal Gill

That one was tough.

[00:32:00.29] - TLO

He even admitted, I guess, recently, alcohol was a huge issue. Yeah.

[00:32:05.14] - TLO

Well, I had somebody close friend of ours, I won't say his name, Trainer. And before, Eero lost thefight, he said, The only person who's going to beat Eero is Eero. He said he drinks all the time. He told

me this three years before he fought against him.

[00:32:24.21] - Kendal Gill

Wow.

[00:32:25.19] - TLO

He said, No, he said he's going to beat himself.

[00:32:27.26] - Kendal Gill

He drinks too much. Then think about the pressure these guys have now where you look back in the

'80s, you have two, three, four losses and still be considered elite. Floyd has turned this into, if you

don't have an O, you're not as good. I mean, that's a really unfair thing because you're talking about

When you got these super fights, you're talking about the best of the best. These things are razor thin.

Look at all the wild or fiery fights. Those are razor thin fights, right? But because Deontay lost those

fights, his His legacy is going to look different than what it would have if he fought in the '80s or '90s.

You're absolutely right about that. It's just another amount of pressure. And guys, as soon as they

take a loss, it's like, you're not great anymore. I just don't understand it.

[00:33:16.08] - TLO

I love being able to talk about this and talking about the dynamic of what boxers have to go through.

People think athletes are robots when you're a When they don't perform, you yell. When they don't do

something you want them to do, you think they're garbage, right? I think somebody told me the other

day, Brian Scalabrini went on some Black Top with a whole bunch of fans, and they were screaming at

him, telling him, You ain't nothing. And Brian was like, Yeah, I'm closer to LeBron James than you will

ever be. And then he just proved that he was just. Right. And so athletes are not robots. I'm sure

everyone in KG, I know you have, too, has gone through a moment of having to say, I need to reset my

mind, value myself, and then go from there. I think of the sport of boxing, what you're doing and what

you advocate is huge and important. So we definitely commend you forThank you. For bringing this to

the forefront.

[00:34:21.15] - Kendal Gill

Thank you so much.

[00:34:21.20] - TLO

I really appreciate. This is great.

[00:34:23.12] - Kendal Gill

Thank you for having me, you guys, because it's really important.

[00:34:25.14] - TLO

Because we have not had a show that addresses mental awareness.

[00:34:29.06] - Kendal Gill

And it doesn't have to be It's sad. I'm trying to make the conversation just be normal. Let's just have a

normal conversation. It doesn't have to be doom and gloom all the time.

[00:34:37.03] - TLO

Yeah. One person I didn't mention, which we're going to talk about here in a second before we get out

of here is Roley. Roley getting knocked out by Javante. I wonder how he handled that first loss. After

you got literally knocked, you were knocked in.

[00:34:50.01] - Kendal Gill

I got my feelings on Roley in general. Roley, he's the worst Well-known fighter in the world. Dervante

and his team did a great job of making him seem legitimate. That dude hasn't thrown a straight punch

in his career. But Roli, to me, it feels fake. That confidence, that shit-talking that he does feels like he's

playing a role more than actually who he is. Going up there when they had that press guy, he's got thefur code on, it's 100 degrees. I was like, Dude, what are you doing, man? This It didn't feel like legit to

me.

[00:35:33.03] - TLO

Yeah. And Telfimo, the other guy I wanted to mention, too, after he lost to cambosis. Knowing that he

wasn't himself, right? And something did not seem right, but for sure, I know he had to go through

something. Yeah.

[00:35:45.00] - Kendal Gill

After losing cambosis. He was not the same. Even after the fight, he didn't sound the same. It took

him a minute. What are you talking about?

[00:35:51.08] - TLO

Didn't he retire for a day or something like that?

[00:35:53.01] - Kendal Gill

Yeah. This is crazy stuff. Again, that's that whole... You have that dopamine release and you just

crash afterwards, When I do these keynote speeches, when I'm done, people want to come up and

talk to me. I understand because they're finally hearing from somebody that they can relate to and

they feel comfortable talking to. But they're all dumping on me, man. I literally have to, if I'm traveling, I

have to go to my hotel room and just get it out for an hour or so. And there's a huge crash. Trinidad

Garcia, my partner in the management team, we talk about this. Even for him, when we've got fighters

fighting, when it's over, when the weekend's over, there's a crash. And it's depressing, right? Because

you're hyped. You've got all this energy and excitement going, and then suddenly, you're done at the

drop of a dime, and you crash.

[00:36:41.27] - TLO

Yeah, it's crazy. But it's Like I said, it's always, and I think nowadays we see it more people just

admitting or just going through the process to be able to take care of themselves. Like I said, it's

always great to see people like you bringing that to the forefront, helping people with with it and just

saying it's okay. It's okay to experience this.

[00:37:04.16] - Kendal Gill

I think we need more men being willing to talk about it, that they struggle, and being willing to talk to

other men about it and open up. Look, nobody can understand what boxers go through, but other

boxers. For the community to be able to talk about it and lean on each other, I think is vitally

important. It's just at some point we've got to figure out a way to all come together and not just be

competing gyms and competitors. This is our sport. We love it. We want to see it grow, and we want

people to be healthy. It's important that everybody succeed, not just one or two gyms. That's right.

[00:37:39.24] - TLO

Absolutely. Well, before we get out of here, Jason, we got to ask you a couple of questions about

what's coming up on May second. May second, a unique event in New York. We talked about it earlier

in Manhattan. Three big fights, three big names in the fights. The third fight of that night is going to be

Telfima Lopez versus Arnold Barbosa Jr. For the super lightweight WBO title. That's going to be an

awesome fight. Any guesses on what's going to happen in that fight?

[00:38:04.24] - Kendal Gill

Man, Barbosa looks so good in that last fight. He's so strong, man. But I feel like Tiafimo has his mojo

back a little bit. He looks like old Tiafimo to me. He does. And again, I always say, boxers be

punchers. I like Tiafimo in this fight. We'll see what happens. It's a 50/50 fight, but I do like Tiafimo.

[00:38:28.10] - TLO

The thing that worries me about Tiafimo is inactivity.

[00:38:32.17] - Kendal Gill

Yeah.[00:38:33.14] - TLO

He got to get more active, man. Because one of these days, he's going to step in that ring. Because of

the inactivity, he's not going to be the same. I worry about this with every one of the boxers because it

seems like for a minute there, earlier this year, we were getting the fight. But it seems like now

everybody's... You look at Earl Spence now, it's what? Two years now he's gone? Yeah. Okay.

[00:38:53.28] - Kendal Gill

Speaking of mental health, the Charlo brothers.

[00:38:56.08] - TLO

Charlo brothers has been so inactive.

[00:38:59.05] - TLO

It's just That's the third fight. The second co-main event is Devon Haynie and Oze Carlos Ramirez,

Junior Weltault. So looking to rebound, obviously.

[00:39:07.10] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, I love Devon.

[00:39:08.23] - TLO

Devon should be the winner. Right.

[00:39:11.00] - Kendal Gill

As long as he isn't completely broken, he should win that fight.

[00:39:15.16] - TLO

Listen, I think Devon Haney, remember, he fought Regis Progray, the fight before he fought Ryan

Garcia. He looked like the best mockfuck in the planet.

[00:39:23.19] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, he looked great. Yeah.

[00:39:25.00] - TLO

The way he did. Yeah. He was touchable.

[00:39:26.07] - Kendal Gill

Yeah. Against a talented guy.

[00:39:27.21] - TLO

He gets a talented guy, Regis Progray. But then that's why I think that the weight thing with Ryan

Garcia and the PD, whatever it was, that's what was the deciding factor in that fight. I'm looking to see

Devon Hane come out and put on a virtuoso performance, then go right back to Ryan Garcia. Please

call him out after you win this fight, Devon Hane.

[00:39:51.13] - TLO

Yeah, for sure. Even though he's the second fight, which is going to the main event, Roley and Ryan

Garcia. I don't think we should even talk about the analysis of that fight. I think we know Ryan should

handle business in that fight. But I guess the big question before we get out of here is, when is that

rematch? Is it this year? Do we see it this year? Do we see it next year? I think-It's signed already.

[00:40:14.16] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, I think we see it later this year. September. Yeah. I mean, if they're going to put them both on the

car together-Canello's date? It's tough to do Canello's date unless Canelo's fighting in Saudi Arabia

and they make that fight here in the States. Because the Saudi Arabia fight is going to be done by 5:

30 or so.[00:40:32.09] - TLO

You can do November. There's big fights.

[00:40:34.05] - TLO

They can do it in November, too. I don't think they'd put that fight on Canello's car.

[00:40:40.03] - TLO

You can't do that.

[00:40:41.04] - Kendal Gill

No, you would have to do it the same night, but you would have to do it domestically. Basically, where

the times are going to be different, right? Because those fights are so early over in Abu Dhabi that you

can get out of the way.

[00:40:51.13] - TLO

Oscar the Prince know what's up. Don't be dumb, guys.

[00:40:54.28] - Kendal Gill

Just separate the events.

[00:40:56.09] - TLO

Do us a favor.

[00:40:58.16] - TLO

Make money on It's on different dates.

[00:41:01.08] - TLO

Because when Devon and Ryan rematch, that is going to be a hell of a fight.

[00:41:06.07] - TLO

It's going to be, yeah. It's going to be Canelo status type fight.

[00:41:08.20] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, for sure. Before we go, I just want to say a little promotion here. Elia Karanza, one of our

fighters. She's taking on Natasha Spence tonight, which is a really big fight. Natasha has been in with

some really difficult fighters in her career. So it's a big test for Elia. We have really high hopes for Elia.

We think she's a world champion. We think after this fight, We deserve a World Championship fight.

Okay, for sure. And then we've got Juan Guerrera fighting next week on the In-a-way car. Vegas. In

Vegas. He's coming off the big Nico Ali Walsh fight. That's right. He's fighting a guy named Art

Barrera Jr.

[00:41:42.08] - TLO

Did he knock out Nico?

[00:41:43.27] - Kendal Gill

No, he won by decision.

[00:41:44.27] - TLO

He wanted to buy a decision.

[00:41:45.18] - Kendal Gill

He wanted to buy a decision. We were really proud of Juan because Juan had to drop a lot of weight

in a short amount of time. For him to drop that weight and come in and still be strong and get that win

was big. He's fighting a prospect from top rank in Art Barrera Jr. He's 8-0 with six KOs. It's going to be

a tough fight. But if you go back and look at who Juan has fought his whole career, he's not fought

anybody with a losing record. He has fought tough guys because that's what he's wanted the whole

time. And this is another example of it. He came off that Nico Ali-Walsh fight and was like, Give meanother killer.

[00:42:16.10] - TLO

I went to the gym two, three weeks ago to Unanimous, and I spoke to him. We had him on. I haven't

posted it yet, but we're going to post it soon. He said he was sick that day. He said he wasn't even

feeling well. But he battled through it, and Juan, he is a gritty fighter. He gets hit and he gets back in

the pocket.

[00:42:36.27] - Kendal Gill

He wants it. He wants to smoke.

[00:42:38.09] - TLO

Big props to Juan, doing his thing against Nico. We're very proud of him in Chicago for what he did.

And Elia as well. Elia, when I spoke to her, when she was here last winter, she was telling people. She

called everybody out. She was like, Listen, man, everybody needs to fight each other. I'm ready. Let's

go.

[00:42:59.11] - Kendal Gill

We can't find I got to fight for Olivia Curry.

[00:43:01.22] - TLO

Everybody's avoiding Olivia.

[00:43:04.24] - Kendal Gill

Olivia reminds me a little of like, Ashawn Porter, which makes it difficult for her to get fights because

she's got to get in there and dirty it up a little bit. Even if you happen to beat Olivia, you're not going to

look good. She's dangerous, and everybody's avoiding her, and I don't understand why. Somebody

needs to step up to that challenge.

[00:43:25.21] - TLO

Number 3, 168.

[00:43:29.01] - Kendal Gill

She This last for 160. She do 160, 168. She's closer to 168.

[00:43:36.07] - TLO

around this time.

Number 3, though, in the country, and she still can't get that fight since we fought in Miami last year

[00:43:44.10] - Kendal Gill

Jumped in there with Shadeza, went the distance with her. It was a great fight.

[00:43:49.00] - TLO

Yeah.

[00:43:50.24] - TLO

We have great stable unanimous boxing, unanimous management, sorry. And shout out to Action

Jack as well, who was doing stream in Dallas. Oh, man.

[00:43:59.03] - Kendal Gill

He was over there. Look, man, Jordan has worked so hard. Chucky, Action Jackson, who's named

Jordan Jackson. He's worked so hard, man, and he's just such a great kid and really talented. He's

long and lanky. When he gets his jab going and follows him up with the right-hand, he is tough to beat

because he starts working up and down. Really good fighter. Roni Jalomo is another one we got.

Shout out to you.

[00:44:20.26] - TLOBig win last weekend as well.

[00:44:22.17] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, man. Roni, we put him in there with a guy, the tough guy we thought would give him some

rounds, and Roni blasted him out of there, which is great, but we need our guys to get some rounds.

[00:44:30.26] - TLO

Take it easy.

[00:44:32.23] - Kendal Gill

Our stable has gotten really good and guys are avoiding us. It's been tough to get fights for our guys,

which is a good problem to have to have good fighters. Bad problem to have when you're having

tough time getting them fights.

[00:44:44.07] - TLO

Absolutely. Big shots to unanimous management. All your boxers will be back in that gym very soon

to see how everything's going and see what's coming next for the crew. Yes, sir.

[00:44:52.14] - Kendal Gill

Once again, where can they follow you, Jason? You can find me at jasonprinzomh, for mental health,

P-R-I-N-Z-O. You can find me there on Instagram. It's probably the easiest way to grab me.

[00:45:04.13] - TLO

Awesome. It's a pleasure having you. We hope to have you soon. We'd love to be back. Some of the

boys and Olivia and even Elia, hopefully, get them in studios.

[00:45:12.20] - Kendal Gill

Yeah, absolutely. Would love that.

[00:45:13.24] - TLO

In the studio. Before we leave the show, don't forget the Parlay is sponsored by 6040 Club. Check us

out. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter. All the links are in the description box. We are on

social media, Parlay Boxing, Chicago. Kg and I always cover, and we want you guys to do it. Once

again, the Parlay. Don't forget to subscribe. We'll see you next time. What up, you all? Tilo here for the

Parlay. Kendall Gill, 15-year NBA veteran in the building, as always. Hey, man, if you like what you just

saw, like, subscribe, hit the notification bell. You guys got to follow us. Season 7 is going to be insane.

We are going to be here. We hope you are here for it. But, Kendall, let's go. On the court. I need my

rematch. That 10-0 game was a fluke. Let's go.

[00:45:51.10] - TLO

Tilo, as the great Floyd Mayweather once said, there are levels for a reason. There are weight classes

for a reason. You're messing with a heavyweight, a professional basketball player. You're a

lightweight. I don't want to take your confidence away from the team. Okay? You've been doing well in

your red leads. You've been winning championships in your red lead. Stay on that level.